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Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst



 
 
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  #11  
Old January 7th 07, 06:49 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
Dave Christian
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst

In article ,
says...

"Wayne" wrote in message
oups.com...
By Michael Lind

The Washington Post

Sunday, December 24, 2006

It's unfair to claim that George W. Bush is the worst president of all
time. He's merely the fifth worst, behind four other Oval Officers
whose policies were even more disastrous: James Buchanan, Andrew
Johnson, Richard M. Nixon and James Madison.

What makes a president horribly, immortally bad? Poor luck is not
enough. Some of the greatest presidents, such as Abraham Lincoln and
Franklin D. Roosevelt, have inherited crises and risen to the occasion.
The damage must be largely self-inflicted. And there's another test:
The damage to the nation must be substantial.

Doing nothing can be even worse than doing something wrong. Take the
worst president of all time, Buchanan. In office when Lincoln's
election in 1860 triggered the secession of one Southern state after
another, Buchanan sat by as the country crumbled. In his December 1860
message to Congress, three months before Lincoln was inaugurated, he
declared that the states had no right to secede, but that the federal
government had no right to stop them. By the time he left office, seven
states had left the Union, and the Confederates had looted the arsenals
in the South. If Buchanan had exercised his powers as commander in
chief, the rebels might have been stopped at far less than the eventual
cost of the Civil War.

The Civil War era also gave us the second-worst president: Johnson,
Lincoln's vice president and successor, a Tennessean who vetoed civil
rights acts and blocked the 14th Amendment because he didn't like
blacks. Johnson's policies led to his impeachment and forced the
Republicans in Congress to create a quasi-parliamentary system
marginalizing the president.

The third-worst president is Mr. Nixon, a criminal in the White House
who is still the only commander-in-chief ever to resign. Many
presidents have abused their power, but he was the only president to
run a criminal gang out of the Oval Office engaging in spying and
burglary while he sought to corrupt the Justice Department, the FBI and
the CIA.

Refusing to enforce the law while the country disintegrates, trying to
re-enslave emancipated blacks, and doubling as chief magistrate and
gangster - what could rival these presidential misdeeds? Unnecessary
and catastrophic wars?

To qualify a president for the Worst of All Time list, a war must be
catastrophic as well as unnecessary. Ronald Reagan's invasion of
Grenada, George H.W. Bush's invasion of Panama and Bill Clinton's
invasion of Haiti were unnecessary, but minor. And presidents can be
forgiven costly wars that were necessary or hard to avoid, such as
Harry S. Truman's stalemated war in Korea and Lyndon B. Johnson's
failed war in Vietnam, each of which was a Cold War battle more than a
separate conflict.

The two big, unjustified wars on my list are the War of 1812 and the
current conflict in Iraq, and the first was far worse than the second.

Madison, the "Father of the Constitution," was a great patriot, a
brilliant intellectual - and an absolutely abysmal president. In his
defense, the United States then was a minor neutral nation frequently
harassed by both of the warring empires, Britain and France. But cold
geopolitics should have led Washington to prefer a British victory,
which would have preserved a balance of power in Europe, to a French
victory that would have left France an unchecked superpower. Instead,
eager to conquer Spanish Florida and seize British Canada, Madison
sided with the more dangerous power against the less dangerous. Gen.
Andrew Jackson's victory in the Battle of New Orleans (waged two weeks
after the United States and Britain, unknown to Jackson, had signed a
peace treaty) helped Americans pretend that the War of 1812 was
something other than a total wipe-out.

By contrast, George W. Bush has inadvertently destroyed only Baghdad,
not Washington, and the costs of the Iraq war in blood and treasure are
far less than those of Korea and Vietnam. Why did Mr. Bush do it? Did
he really believe that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction?
Was it about oil? Israel? Revenge for Hussein's alleged attempt on Mr.
Bush's father's life? The war will join the sinking of the USS Maine
and the grassy knoll among the topics to exercise conspiracy theorists
for generations.

Like all presidents, George W. Bush wants to be remembered. He will get
his wish - as the fifth-worst president in U.S. history.



Nixon was not a criminal - he conducted some minor criminal activity with
watergate. This does not make him a criminal.
I drove a truck last weekend. This does not make me a truck driver.


Yes it does. You're a truck driver - in addition to the other things
are.

Nixon, in conducting criminal activity (minor?!), is also a criminal,
among the other things he was.
  #12  
Old January 7th 07, 07:13 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,164
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst


"Wayne" wrote in message
oups.com...

David wrote:


Nixon was not a criminal - he conducted some minor criminal activity with
watergate. This does not make him a criminal.
I drove a truck last weekend. This does not make me a truck driver.
You can't assess his term as president based on the Watergate incident.
His
presidency needs to be assessed on foreign policy, the economy, social
progress etc. In those terms he was one of the better presidents.
Watergate
was an isolated incident


LOL, yes, I'm sure Bush will be forgiven for the Iraq war debacle
because it was, of course, "an isolated incident".


Why don't you dopey ****s stop cross posting? In mfw we still think
logically
Watergate is an isolated incident because it was an operation that took a
day or two to accomplish. Cost zero lives, a few hundred dollars
Iraq is NOT an isolated incident because it is an all encompassing operation
costing 100,000 lives, $150 billion dollars and of longer duration than WW2
I can't believe how ****ing stupid you ****s are





  #13  
Old January 7th 07, 07:13 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,164
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst


"samson" wrote in message
...
After serious thinking David wrote :
"Wayne" wrote in message
oups.com...


Nixon was not a criminal - he conducted some minor criminal activity with
watergate.


You are not what the Norse Berserkers would call a smrat man.

No, I am not smrat not do I wish to be


  #14  
Old January 7th 07, 07:15 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,164
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst


"Dave Christian" wrote in message
...
In article ,
says...

"Wayne" wrote in message
oups.com...
By Michael Lind

The Washington Post

Sunday, December 24, 2006

It's unfair to claim that George W. Bush is the worst president of all
time. He's merely the fifth worst, behind four other Oval Officers
whose policies were even more disastrous: James Buchanan, Andrew
Johnson, Richard M. Nixon and James Madison.

What makes a president horribly, immortally bad? Poor luck is not
enough. Some of the greatest presidents, such as Abraham Lincoln and
Franklin D. Roosevelt, have inherited crises and risen to the occasion.
The damage must be largely self-inflicted. And there's another test:
The damage to the nation must be substantial.

Doing nothing can be even worse than doing something wrong. Take the
worst president of all time, Buchanan. In office when Lincoln's
election in 1860 triggered the secession of one Southern state after
another, Buchanan sat by as the country crumbled. In his December 1860
message to Congress, three months before Lincoln was inaugurated, he
declared that the states had no right to secede, but that the federal
government had no right to stop them. By the time he left office, seven
states had left the Union, and the Confederates had looted the arsenals
in the South. If Buchanan had exercised his powers as commander in
chief, the rebels might have been stopped at far less than the eventual
cost of the Civil War.

The Civil War era also gave us the second-worst president: Johnson,
Lincoln's vice president and successor, a Tennessean who vetoed civil
rights acts and blocked the 14th Amendment because he didn't like
blacks. Johnson's policies led to his impeachment and forced the
Republicans in Congress to create a quasi-parliamentary system
marginalizing the president.

The third-worst president is Mr. Nixon, a criminal in the White House
who is still the only commander-in-chief ever to resign. Many
presidents have abused their power, but he was the only president to
run a criminal gang out of the Oval Office engaging in spying and
burglary while he sought to corrupt the Justice Department, the FBI and
the CIA.

Refusing to enforce the law while the country disintegrates, trying to
re-enslave emancipated blacks, and doubling as chief magistrate and
gangster - what could rival these presidential misdeeds? Unnecessary
and catastrophic wars?

To qualify a president for the Worst of All Time list, a war must be
catastrophic as well as unnecessary. Ronald Reagan's invasion of
Grenada, George H.W. Bush's invasion of Panama and Bill Clinton's
invasion of Haiti were unnecessary, but minor. And presidents can be
forgiven costly wars that were necessary or hard to avoid, such as
Harry S. Truman's stalemated war in Korea and Lyndon B. Johnson's
failed war in Vietnam, each of which was a Cold War battle more than a
separate conflict.

The two big, unjustified wars on my list are the War of 1812 and the
current conflict in Iraq, and the first was far worse than the second.

Madison, the "Father of the Constitution," was a great patriot, a
brilliant intellectual - and an absolutely abysmal president. In his
defense, the United States then was a minor neutral nation frequently
harassed by both of the warring empires, Britain and France. But cold
geopolitics should have led Washington to prefer a British victory,
which would have preserved a balance of power in Europe, to a French
victory that would have left France an unchecked superpower. Instead,
eager to conquer Spanish Florida and seize British Canada, Madison
sided with the more dangerous power against the less dangerous. Gen.
Andrew Jackson's victory in the Battle of New Orleans (waged two weeks
after the United States and Britain, unknown to Jackson, had signed a
peace treaty) helped Americans pretend that the War of 1812 was
something other than a total wipe-out.

By contrast, George W. Bush has inadvertently destroyed only Baghdad,
not Washington, and the costs of the Iraq war in blood and treasure are
far less than those of Korea and Vietnam. Why did Mr. Bush do it? Did
he really believe that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction?
Was it about oil? Israel? Revenge for Hussein's alleged attempt on Mr.
Bush's father's life? The war will join the sinking of the USS Maine
and the grassy knoll among the topics to exercise conspiracy theorists
for generations.

Like all presidents, George W. Bush wants to be remembered. He will get
his wish - as the fifth-worst president in U.S. history.



Nixon was not a criminal - he conducted some minor criminal activity with
watergate. This does not make him a criminal.
I drove a truck last weekend. This does not make me a truck driver.


Yes it does. You're a truck driver - in addition to the other things
are.

Nixon, in conducting criminal activity (minor?!), is also a criminal,
among the other things he was.


Semantics - the isolated watergate incident should not define an otherwise
successful presidency - just like Clinton 'lied' about getting a bj should
not mar his successful terms


  #16  
Old January 7th 07, 07:31 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
Joe Ramirez
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst


David wrote:
"Wayne" wrote in message
oups.com...

David wrote:


Nixon was not a criminal - he conducted some minor criminal activity with
watergate. This does not make him a criminal.
I drove a truck last weekend. This does not make me a truck driver.
You can't assess his term as president based on the Watergate incident.
His
presidency needs to be assessed on foreign policy, the economy, social
progress etc. In those terms he was one of the better presidents.
Watergate
was an isolated incident


LOL, yes, I'm sure Bush will be forgiven for the Iraq war debacle
because it was, of course, "an isolated incident".


Why don't you dopey ****s stop cross posting? In mfw we still think
logically
Watergate is an isolated incident because it was an operation that took a
day or two to accomplish.


I can't stand it -- Watergate was an elaborate conspiracy to obstruct
justice that lasted for *years.*

Joe Ramirez

  #17  
Old January 7th 07, 07:33 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
J. Hugh Sullivan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst

On 7 Jan 2007 09:07:26 -0800, "Wayne" wrote:

By Michael Lind

The Washington Post

Sunday, December 24, 2006

It's unfair to claim that George W. Bush is the worst president of all
time. He's merely the fifth worst, behind four other Oval Officers
whose policies were even more disastrous: James Buchanan, Andrew
Johnson, Richard M. Nixon and James Madison.


Has history been revised so that Lyndon Johnson and Jimmy Carter were
not presidents - to mention only two?

Hugh
  #18  
Old January 7th 07, 07:34 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
Robert Nicholson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst

If Bush isn't the worse who then is the most inarticulate?

Please tell me this country hasn't had any President who cannot speak
in public without reading from a prepared script or rehashing the same
old talking points over and over. Or perhaps he'll go down as the least
challenged in public by the media?

When Bush is remembered he will be known as the president who crippled
the US miltary and who acted consistently against the majority of the
publics wishes and who single handedly rewrote the constitution.

Bush will be known as the president of low wages, human rights
violations, tax breaks, high oil prices and unnecessary wars and who
lowered the reputation of America and Americans all throughout the
world.

  #19  
Old January 7th 07, 07:40 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
Head Shot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 99
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst

David wrote:
Semantics - the isolated watergate incident should not define an
otherwise successful presidency - just like Clinton 'lied' about
getting a bj should not mar his successful terms


Clinton lied under oath. Nixon was involved in a felony break-in. Neither
should be remembered for anything but being scumbags.

--
__________________________________________________ _________
A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises,
I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it
gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. -- Thomas
Jefferson


  #20  
Old January 7th 07, 07:44 PM posted to rec.sport.tennis,rec.sport.soccer,misc.fitness.weights,rec.sport.football.college,rec.sport.golf
Head Shot
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 99
Default Where will Bush rank? He's only fifth worst

Joe Ramirez wrote:
I can't stand it -- Watergate was an elaborate conspiracy to obstruct
justice that lasted for *years.*


At the end of the day; Clinton should just have said "none of your ****ing
business" when asked about having sex with a consenting adult other than
his wife. It was a witch hunt anyway - no sane person thinks the US
Government should have spent $20M to find out if Monica had sperm on her
dress. I'm nost sure where that expenditure falls into the US
Constitution. Cheating on your wife, while deplorable, is most certainly
not criminal.


 




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